Where Does the Leader Go...by Amie

I've often felt useless when I see someone who has been an encouragement to me go through their own trials.  I feel that I couln't possibly do them justice after all that they've been to me. 

It appears that by the way Eliphaz is speaking to Job in chapter 5 about how he has been an encourangement to so many that Job himself just might be one of those mighty men of God for his own community.  Then in chapter 6, he goes on to ask Job (basically paraphrased), "So which one of the religious peoples are you gonna go to for help now that you're in need?"  Of all the ways that Job's been described, this is the first time I've thought of him as one of the "top dogs" of religious matters.  I just thought he happened to be famous for how prosperous he was and he also "happened" to be a righteous man, but now I really believe he was the one to go to for counsel, spiritual guidance, comfort, etc.  So, again, who does that "top dog" go to?  Why of course, he goes to God.  But this also tells me that we're all vulnerable to go through suffering whether you're the student or the teacher, the seeker of advice or the advice columnist, the lay person or the pastor...and when the "top dog" finds himself in need of comfort, there's no reason why he can't seek for it in his friends even if his friends don't consider themselves to be at his level.  I hope that all those who I consider to be mentors to me, consider me to be a friend, not just a student, and someone who would listen and offer comforting words.  I'd hate to think that someone would feel they don't have anyone to go to just because they're usually the one giving the advice.

 The heartfelt counsel of a friend
      is as sweet as perfume and incense.

Proverbs 27:9

Universal Questions...by Terri

How many times have we had what I would have to now call a Job moment? Have we ever doubted God? Have we ever gotten angery at Him? Have we called out to Him, beliving in our hearts, He will not answer, (how could He answer to deaf ears)? Have we looked for answers from friends, even family while ignoring what God was trying to say? God will go out of His way to get our attention, to have our full focus on Him. Have we ever stood before Him, tears falling, ears closed except for the answers to our questons that never seem to come? Have we ever felt that death might be the only answer to many, many why's?

Terri

Some WEEK TWO Thoughts from Corinne

A Few Insights...

• I am wondering if Eliphaz in his own mind and intentions thought he was coming alongside and telling the truth in love. I think it is important to prayerfully examine your motives or even the truth of what you believe before you act.
• I am still surprised that Job fell so completely apart in his reactions. It was as if he did not remember how blessed his life had been.
• It is easy for a person to become self righteous when they are faced with a situation that is comparable to what the friends of Job participated in.
• When a friend behaves the way Eliphaz did it is important for you to consider what is being said without getting angry or upset.  However, we are in charge of what we accept and what we reject.  It is important to consider the input and decide what is true for the situation and what is not. If you can do this it is like not throwing the baby out with the bathwater.  (Remember the example of the bullet proof vest.)

Application to my life...

I believe that no matter what the challenge or need that Jehovah Jirah will provide. In the end I do not have to worry because of this. Job was not so lucky.  He is caught in the moment when his entire life has been taken away with it.  The only thing he has left is his actual life. I know his outcome, but he does not. I hope that if I ever have a Job experience I will remember these understandings that I have now.


God's Character...

I think that Eliphaz did a good job on pointing out the character of God.  The only problem is that he uses then as battering rams for Job.

• BESTOWS~ blessings, health, prosperity…Jehovah Jirah
• LIFTS~ especially the ones who are suffering
• SAVES~ from despair, failure, and the meanness and ill will of the powerful
• RESCUES~ from danger, from ourselves and our bad choices
• PROTECTS~ from danger and the ravages of evil.

Job's Response...by Liz

Oh my goodness, right when i started to read chapter 6 and read the first verse, " If my misery could be weighed and my troubles be put on the scales", took my back to a place of when i was going through a very hard time. It reminded me of the moments i felt like the world was on my shoulders, i felt the pain just coming over my heart and i thought there would not be an end to that deep pain I was experiancing. My heart breaks for Job. Because even though we have faith in God, doesn't mean we wont feel deep pain. Job was a blameless man, but he was also human with emotions. I just love how in verse 5 of chapter 6, he questioned, " Dont I have a right to complain?" Of coarse he does. He was not cursing God or he wasnt blaming God, he just wanting to say, "Hey, Im a human being, I have a right to feel." As sad as this story of Job is , i praise God with all of my heart for allowing my to see that even someone as faithful as Job felt alot of pain and yet, he did not turn his back on God. Why is that it takes times of trouble to happen for us to get closer to HIm? Is it because we want a miracle to come our way or is because we truly pay attention to what He is doing in us in the midst of troubles?? I hope this makes sense, why is it that i can really relate to Job, the diferance is, that i am not blameless, I fall short and I allow for busyness to take over my relationship with my Father.

Written by Liz

Some WEEK ONE Thoughts from Corinne

Week One…Chapters 1-3

Day 1: What are your first thoughts or impressions on what you just read?

·         I got up from my desk and went out to get a cup of coffee, saying to God, “Wow that is an uplifting little piece of scripture, Lord!” Then I said a prayer asking Him to open my mind and heart to whatever He has to give Me. I also asking him to help me with my preformed attitude about Him where Job is concerned…getting a bit of a laugh when it occurred to me that my having any kind of attitude against God was laughable, foolhardy, non productive, and a total waste of time.

·         I thought of the words to the song “Blessed Be”

Every blessing You pour out

I'll turn back to praise

When the darkness closes in, Lord

Still I will say

Blessed be the name of the Lord

·         Job had the right attitude in how he dealt with his suffering in the beginning. He did not have a pity party and even if he had he would not have been condemned for it. Those were terrible things to have to deal with.

·         I still cannot understand why God would turn Job over to the devil for such torment. However, I have enough faith to believe that God has a plan for us and that He would never hurt us.  I don’t think I would ever verbally attack God because something bad has happened to me. But in Job’s case it just seemed without reason. Still the Bible says in 1:22 In all this, Job did not sin by charging God with wrongdoing.

·         As I am typing this it comes to mind that we and all we are and have belong to God for Him to use to his purposes as He will. Job had much wealth and good fortune, but it all came from God. He gives and takes away.

·         In addition, sometimes when we do seem to be enduring many trials that come one after one that is the very time when God is helping us see a lesson and preparing us for higher heights. I need to remember that.

·         When things started to go bad it was like one thing after another. Sometimes this is how it feels leaving us stressed and paralyzed by our pain.

·         Still I would hate to think that a trial that I was enduring was happening so God could teach Satan a lesson.

·         In Chapter 3 he is reduced to a bit of a whiner, but not without cause. It is just that we have Job presented to us of an example of human perfection and courage, but even this mighty man of God is reduced in the end.

·         When Job’s friends show up they just sit with him. They do not talk.  In the last year I have had two of my friends facing unthinkable obstacles.  I am a person who likes to point out why I think someone is awesome…a kind of cheerleader with pompoms.  Recently one of them (when I was doing my sis boom bah) told me that that may be well and good but in the end it does not matter. I realized that sometimes a person just has to go through it with no side crutches.

Day 2: What verse or verses did the Holy Spirit bring to your mind to meditate on and what does it mean to you?

There were several verses in these chapters that made me stop and think.

• In Chapter 1:7
  “The LORD said to Satan, "Where have you come from?" Satan answered the     LORD, "From roaming through the earth and going back and forth in it.”Although this is not deep or hard to understand it is a warning to me to be cautious.  We all know this to be true, but we do not always have our guard up and so many times Satan catches us unaware. And he is such a slimy sneak. When he tempts us it is not overt in nature.  He would not tell us to kill someone, because that would fail.  He comes in and masks the temptation in so many ways that we can fail to see that it is in fact from him. Then we fall.  I need to keep this in the forefront of my consciousness.
• In Chapter 1:22“In  all this, Job did not sin by charging God with wrongdoing.”
  And again in Chapter 2:3b
  “And he still maintains his integrity, though you incited me against him to ruin him without any reason."Again in Chapter 2:10
  ‘He replied, "You are talking like a foolish   woman. Shall we accept good from God, and not trouble?"In these three verses Job does not act out. He is taking it like a man.  Though he is blameless himself he does not blame God for his tribulations. When his wire starts complaining and tell him to let go of his integrity and to just curse God and die Job takes her to task and reminds here that they have to accept not only good from God but trouble as well. He calls her foolish but the Hebrew word used means “moral deficiency.” Personal integrity and morality is a very important thing. I feel that I need to think about this and make some changes in the way I look at and do things. (gossip, complaining, procrastination, untruthfulness)
  
• In Chapter 3:22Why is life given to a man
         whose way is hidden,
         whom God has hedged in?
  I think Job was finally skating on thin ice here by accusing God of “hedging in” a person so that he cannot see his path ahead of time. I believe that God gives us every opportunity to choose our path.  Sometimes when bad things happen it is due to free will of ourselves and others not due God’s laying some sort of trap or roadblock.

Day 3: How did you see God's character come through in these chapters?

• Aware ~ As in all knowing. He knew the kind of man Job was. He knew Satan could not win.
• Loyal ~ God spoke well of Job and believed in him.
• Patient ~ God did not become upset or impatient when Job finally started venting. He was also willing to wait it out and give Job a chance to prove the kind of man he was. He was even patient with Satan to a certain extent.

Day 4: What did you find that you can apply to your life?

• It is useless to flail around when life brings troubles. 
• I need to be able to accept the good and the trials.
• I need to know that in the end of any challenge and in the middle of it God is always there.  He will never leave us or forsake us. 
• I need to believe that He is trustworthy.
• Integrity and morality are very important to the holy life.  This does not only mean in the big things that are sinful. It also means in the little things that affect how you live your life and your character.
• Waiting on the Lord is one of the most important things to enact. In the end it is the difference in going off half cocked and making a mess of life or considering the options in prayerful communication with God so that choices made lead to the kind of life I am hoping to live…a holy life.

Day 5: Are there any questions, concerns, or new insights about what you read that you could bring to the group for discussion?

• He is God and I am not. Still I have questions.
• I was surprised to see that it was God who initiated the conversation about Job with Satan.  I had always thought that Satan was badgering God about Job and how he would be as bad as anyone if he lost his material possessions. This was not true. God introduced Job into that conversation. From my dim human view through a glass darkly it seems to me that Satan baited God and God took his worm. It is hard for me to understand how God would let Satan have full reign to do harm to Job. Again I am having an ah hah moment here.  This is the way it always is. Satan to some extent is free to “roam the earth going back and forth in it.” And since we have been given free will we are free to follow him back and forth or to keep our eyes on the sky to be led by God. There would be no wonder in salvation if we were all puppets on the Marionette’s strings. All of this said I still do not understand entirely. We use our free will to form our own path.  The fly in the ice-cream in the story of Job is that he did not use his free will to choose anything . He was attacked, and it seems that God was willing for that to happen.
• One insight that I received here is that no matter what happens the important thing is how we react to it. I just thought about Jesus who just stood there and did not fight back. He did not curse his tormentors. He did not scream his rage at what was happening to Him. If we are going through a trial period and we keep our integrity and moral behavior, we have won where there could have been great losses.

LIFE...by Amie

After studying Job chapters 1-3, I meditated on chapter 3 and Job’s lament.  Here we have Job not only cursing the day he was born, but even the day he was conceived.  I've never been in such deep depression in my own life, but, after all that he'd been through, I can't say that I blame him for expressing such extremes.  I really can't fathom the amount of pain he was in.  However, verses 16 and 17 speak of his desire to have died before he even left the womb and how much better he felt it would've been to never have been born in order to avoid such pain. 

My mind went to the issue of miscarriages, abortions, and still births...lives coming to an end before they've even had the chance to begin.  It seems to me that one of the typical phrases used to consul someone when they've lost a loved one is "They're in a better place."  I know that these are typical words even in the case of a life that was ended before it was born.  It seems that worldly wisdom would have us believe that the reason for the life to have ended was God's way of allowing the child to avoid something in life.  The usual reasons would be, "...painful medical challenges...," and, "...traumatic family life...."  But after reading Job's wish to have perished in the womb himself, my gut feeling told me that there are no justifiable reasons to explain the loss of a life, especially a life that never even had a chance to begin. 

Such a tragedy is exactly just that...a tragedy; the type of occurrences that have no explanation to them because we don't have the mind of God.  If we're right in explaining away a life because they would avoid suffering, then what does that say about those who survive in spite of the suffering they have in store for them?  I guess my question is this, do we not value life the way we should?  Shouldn't we value just being alive far beyond the suffering that's experienced?  I really think that there's more to this "being alive thing" that we just don't fully grasp.  After all, I can't think of a single person who could tell me what it's like to never have been given a chance.  Can you? 

Why is it that even in the greatest physical suffering when the mind is telling the body to give up and wishing that its life was over, the body is still going through all the survival mechanisms programmed into it (by God Himself) to keep the body alive?  It's not as easy as the mind telling the body to die.  The body just keeps on fighting to live. 

Could it be that all the miscarried, aborted and stillborn babies who are with Jesus right now are, dare I say, envious that they never made it past the womb alive and experienced the breath of life that God desires for all of us to have?  Is there something about having that breath, even just once, that we just don't get?  It's a gift, isn't it?  I don't think we understand how great of a gift it truly is...so great that it's worth all the suffering that comes along with it. 

Now technically, I do believe that life begins at conception, not birth.  (That makes it all the more significant that Job not only cursed the day he was born, but the day he was conceived.  He must have been a believer in life beginning at conception as well.)  Although the lungs aren't fully expanded and filled with air until birth, I believe that God's breath of life fills us the moment we're conceived...that moment that two cells come together and a living being is created...that moment that cannot be explained by science as to why and how it happens but just that it happens is the moment that God steps in and does what science cannot do.  After all, the first breath of life was breathed into man by God Himself. 

So maybe I’m wrong in thinking that they (the unborn babies) had no chance to live since they lived right from conception.  You can’t die if you didn’t live, and a life ended before birth is still a life ended.  The point is that life is so precious.  There's just no "reason" for it ever to be ended except that we live in a fallen world, for living in a fallen world is the only answer to why…why do such tragedies occur?  And if it is such a tragedy, why wish for it?  You can’t remedy one tragic situation by wishing for another.

O.K., I will concede that in one sense, death is a blessing.  The moment that sin entered the world, death came along with it and most of the time death is viewed as a curse, but there is mercy in it.  For if God was not merciful enough to allow for death, we would all be living forever in a cursed world.  But God is just.  He has our days numbered and decides when He’ll allow for death to come.  Since, as I said before, we don’t have the mind of God, we can never do justice to the reasons why death comes at the times that it does.  We can be sorry for it, we can thank God for His wisdom in it, but we just should never wish for it.  Let's not forget that although God did not necessarily step in and prevent Job's suffering, He was not willing for Job to lose his life.

Genesis 2:7 The Lord God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.

Amie Spruiell 9/14/2010